Trump’s Election Means A Chance For “A Return To Reason In Climate Policy”, German Expert Writes

Physicist Dr. Peter Heller wrote at the German language Science Skeptical here how the election of Donald Trump could mean “the return to reason in climate policy” and that there may be a course change: “one away from trying to do what’s good for the climate, to one that does what is good for man.”

Peter Heller

Physicist Dr. Peter Heller. Photo: FDP

He writes:

This is neither dangerous nor unscientific – rather it is optimistic. It holds the promise for a better future that offers more than just the energy savings variant of the present.”

Heller views both opposite extreme positions taken by the radical elements on either side of the debate as irreconcilable and are in fact “nonsense that have more to to do with belief than with science.”

Heller then adds that if the climate alarmists had their way, they “would not only destroy our current prosperity, but also rob mankind of all options to further prosper in the future.”

Today Heller sees hope for a return to reason in climate policy given the “current developments“. One reason for hope he cites is the recently watered down Climate Plan 2050 submitted by the German government at the recent Climate Conference in Morocco. Ultimately Germany was not ready to deindustrialize after all. Heller believes:

Thirty years of climate diplomacy where tens of thousands of taxpayer-funded politicians, bureaucrats and scientists jetted to large conferences and congresses at attractive touristic locations were useless. […] After the election Donald Trump to President of the United States, the gate for better policy has finally opened endlessly wide.”

In his analysis Heller of course agrees that man has an impact on climate and that the greenhouse effect is real, but that this does not necessarily mean climate change is climate catastrophe. He thinks climate sensitivity is closer to 1°C per doubling of CO2. He calls the claims that climate is only worsening “pure speculation” and the claim that man-made climate change is taking us to a climate catastrophe is based on “numerous assumptions“.

Heller also thinks that human ingenuity with respect to adapting to new conditions is being hugely underestimated, reminding readers that humans have adapted to and mastered every climate zone on the planet.

Even in regions where there are frequent drought periods, powerful storms or flooding, man did not retreat. His ingenuity overcame all obstacles. The temperature range within which civilization spread went far beyond the range of 2°C.”

As part of this adaptation, Heller calls fossil energies “a moral necessity” because we use them to generate our prosperity and to produce products of every type that benefit our lives.

In many applications they are indispensable and some are not so easily replaceable, as the 2°C target demands. In summary their advantages substantially outweigh their disadvantages. […] Fossil fuels not freed humanity from feudal exploitation and slavery because they provide an efficient and effective supply through machines, they have foremost enabled us to refrain from consuming biomass as a form of energy and thus prevented the destruction of the environment. In the 18th century when charcoal was substituted by coke in iron smelting, forests once again were able to expand.”

Heller sees Donald Trump as a “new start”, someone who will expand the production of fossil fuels and end the climate protection policy of Obama, and thus with it usher in a series of economic, social and political advantages.

This could introduce the end of international climate diplomacy in its current form, as countries like Russia, China or India are also poised for a reorientation.”

The German physicist calls the howls and gnashing of teeth now taking place within the German mainstream media “over-the-top and wrong”.

He summarizes:

From the very beginning it was a fundamental mistake by climate policy to allow political activists from climate research to have the say. Donald Trump’s program puts the setting of guidelines where it really belongs: in a policymaking that that does not focus on the welfare of the climate, but rather on the welfare on mankind. Climate protection through decarbonization does not offer anything to anyone. In the end even its proponents are left with nothing except a good feeling.”

 

88 responses to “Trump’s Election Means A Chance For “A Return To Reason In Climate Policy”, German Expert Writes”

  1. sod

    Trump knows nothing about the climate. Why would he bring a better policy?

    Actually Trump is a denialist (“climate change was invented by the chinese”) and even Peter Heller thinks that those are wrong:

    “Und natürlich wird auch eine Veränderung der Zusammensetzung der Atmosphäre nicht ohne Folgen bleiben. Der atmosphärische Treibhauseffekt existiert. Er widerspricht nicht den Hauptsätzen der Thermodynamik, sondern ist ganz im Gegenteil eine zwingende Folge derselben.”

    So Heller thinks, that some3one who does not understand the basics will get the policy right. That is plain out stupid.

    1. AndyG55

      “That is plain out stupid.”

      Are you talking about Obarmy and Jon Kerry.. that absolute base level of any sort of climate knowledge.

      Trump knows how to build a support that DOES know how things really work

      Obarmy only built a load of yes-sir, zero-knowledge psychophants.

      1. yonason

        A little laugh at sod’s expense.
        https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CJ_MEH5UYAAWCUY.jpg

        1. Chris F

          Trump knows nothing about the climate. Why would he bring a better policy?

          Answer:
          Donald Trump’s program puts the setting of guidelines where it really belongs: in a policymaking that that does not focus on the welfare of the climate, but rather on the welfare on mankind.

          1. yonason

            Exactly.

          2. David Appell

            How much does mankind prosper under climate change, per deg C of warming?

            What are the costs of climate change, per deg C of warming?

        2. Jeff

          Wally has some “contributions” too:
          http://assets.amuniversal.com/2dcdaeb06cc901301d50001dd8b71c47

        3. yonason

          “How much does mankind prosper under climate change, per deg C of warming?” – David Appell

          At the very worst, you do nothing, and nothing bad happens. The savings over the wasteful useless “solutions” proposed by the Climateers is in the $$$Trillions!!!

          “What are the costs of climate change, per deg C of warming?” – David Appell

          At the very most a few dollars more in the summer for more air conditioning, which would be offset by the money saved on heating in the winter. And as a bonus, extended growing seasons, with greater yield. Then there might be fewer excess winter deaths. Probably more, but those alone would be worth it.

          1. David Appell

            yonason wrote:
            “How much does mankind prosper under climate change, per deg C of warming?” – David Appell

            “At the very worst, you do nothing, and nothing bad happens.”

            Prove it.

            I’m not interested in what you think — I’m interested in what you can prove.

          2. yonason

            @David Appell

            “I’m not interested in what you think — I’m interested in what you can prove.”

            I don’t have to “prove” that your crappy ideas don’t work.

            It’s up to you to prove your idiotically insane measures will make life better for people. So far, all they’ve done is make a few con artists richer, and lots of poor people poorer, with zero affect on climate.

            You are an activist, not a scientist, and a pretty nasty one at that.

    2. Will Janoschka

      sod 4. December 2016 at 8:56 PM

      “Trump knows nothing about the climate. Why would he bring a better policy?”

      Trump is not biased by your CAGW religious fantasy! More to the piont your self proclaimed meteorologists, climatologists, atmospheric physicists know nothing about the interaction of atmospheric CO2 and thermal electromagnetic radiative flux in this Earth’s atmosphere.

      “So Heller thinks, that someone who does not understand the basics will get the policy right. That is plain out stupid.”

      Only in your own form of insanity! You promote those that wish maximum control over what may be left of humanity after there purge of any dissidents!

      The oath of office for Trump only requires that he defend the US Constitution! The most active defense\offense will be against you and your academic fraudsters that have by your actions, declared war on the US population and their Constitution.

      1. sod

        “Trump is not biased by your CAGW religious fantasy! 2

        i am just applying logic.

        To make a good climate policy, a politician must understand climate science. Trump does not.

        Heller does actually specifically mention, that denial of AGW is stupid. Trump denies AGW.

        1. David Johnson

          Utter rubbish sod and you wouldn’t recognise logic if it smacked you in the face. Understanding doesn’t come into it. A good leader just needs to employ advisers who do understand. Something Obama signally failed to do as has been previously mentioned in this thread

          1. AndyG55

            “A good leader just needs to employ advisers who do understand.”

            Yep, and the Donald nails it yet again.

            “Donald Trump’s next head of the Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) could be his most inspired and devastatingly effective pick yet. The name of this dark horse candidate is Don van der Vaart and if reports that he is being considered are true, then he may go down in history as the first EPA administrator who actually has a clue what he is doing. ”

            http://www.breitbart.com/environment/2016/12/06/donald-trumps-environmental-protection-agency-chief-could-be-his-best-pick-yet/

          2. sod

            You are really supporting a polluter like van der Vaart ?

            http://www.northcarolinahealthnews.org/2016/05/19/deq-duke-needs-to-dig-up-all-its-coal-ash/

            He was helping Duke energy to get away with polluting rivers and water with coal ash.

            McCrory is gone. Being a corrupt right wing anti-science guy might not be good for staying elected…

          3. David Appell

            Problem is, Trump is only appointing lackeys and boot lickers and ideologues who agree with his extreme positions.

            And the facts who they all — every one of them — a dangerous climate denier.

        2. yonason

          “To make a good climate policy, a politician must understand climate science” – sod

          Oh, yeah, you mean like Al Gore.
          http://drsircus.com/world-news/climate/the-nine-lies-of-al-gore-2

          And then there’s “climatologist” Gavin Schmidt
          http://hockeyschtick.blogspot.com/2010/04/nasas-gavin-schmidts-lies-damned-lies.html

          All he needs is a modicum of intelligence, coupled with honesty and common sense. But then, you wouldn’t know how to relate to any of that.

    3. M E

      Perhaps sod can comment on the report rather than attack Mr Trump. Mr Trump has so far given away very little about his opinions on “climate change”. He plays his cards close to his chest. Newsmedia reports of his opinions are mostly speculation and made to fill up a space so that the next edition can be put on line.
      ……
      Heller views both opposite extreme positions taken by the radical elements on either side of the debate as irreconcilable and are in fact “nonsense that have more to to do with belief than with science.”
      ……….
      seems to be the main thrust of this report.

      Perhaps sod can discuss this with illustrations from both sides of the question and then give a reasoned conclusion.

      1. sod

        “Mr Trump has so far given away very little about his opinions on “climate change”. He plays his cards close to his chest.”

        No, he does not. He thinks that climate change was invented by the chinese . But they are actually doing a lot for fighting it and they are beating the all of us on electric cars.

        “Perhaps sod can discuss this with illustrations from both sides of the question and then give a reasoned conclusion.”

        you will not like my opinion. There is no second side to this story and what Heller does there is false balance. AGW is real and it is causing dangers. Pollution is real and it is causing damage. Coal, oil and nuclear are problematic sources of power.

        Renewables are the future. And there is no other side to this.

      2. David Appell

        M E wrote:
        “Mr Trump has so far given away very little about his opinions on “climate change”. He plays his cards close to his chest.”

        Um, no he doesn’s. There is at least 5 yrs of his Tweets on this subject.

  2. sod

    ” Climate protection through decarbonization does not offer anything to anyone. In the end even its proponents are left with nothing except a good feeling.””

    Of course it does. It removes the power from the people who control oil and coal.

    1. AndyG55

      I know I would far rather control of energy be in the hands of oil and coal, than in the money grabbing, subsidy scamming, fraudsters of the green energy farce.

    2. jim

      “It removes the power from the people who control oil and coal.”
      And gives that power to unelected scientifically illiterate bureaucrats who are climate zealots that care NOTHING about our well being.

      The people who run the oil and coal companies ONLY retain their power by satisfying their customers. Unlike government bureaucrats who get power by catering to nutcases like the climate lobby.

      1. sod

        “The people who run the oil and coal companies ONLY retain their power by satisfying their customers. ”

        you are right. The current attempt by OPEC to raise prices is definitely a move to make customers happy!

        1. David Johnson

          You may have not noticed SOD but OPEC is run by Governments and mainly unelected ones at that and NOT western oil companies.

          1. David Appell

            So what?

          2. sod

            “OPEC is run by Governments and mainly unelected ones at that and NOT western oil companies.”

            i was talking about those who control oil and coal.

            Are you trying to make the utterly false claim that western oil companies are unhappy about the OPEC decision and higher oil prices? or were you just making up irrelevant stuff to confuse the facts?

  3. Don

    SOD = Same Old drivel

  4. John F. Hultquist

    Donald Trump says and does things to drive opponents crazy and get millions of dollars of free publicity. The remark about the Chinese starting the global warming scam was such a comment. He, and everyone else, knows it was started by the German Greens.
    Here is a part of one of Trump’s tweets:
    So, I have spent almost nothing on my run for president and am in 1st place. Jeb Bush has spent $59 million & done.”

    Note to anyone that thinks Trump knows nothing — you have been conned.
    Suggestion for anyone that thinks Trump and his advisers know nothing — Start with the Nov. 21 post by Scott Adams:
    http://blog.dilbert.com/post/153480921421/persuasion-versus-populism

    Read forward and back in Adams’ blog if you have the time.
    If you do, you will have a better understanding of what has happened and what will happen.

    1. sod

      “Donald Trump says and does things to drive opponents crazy and get millions of dollars of free publicity. The remark about the Chinese starting the global warming scam was such a comment. He, and everyone else, knows it was started by the German Greens.2

      Donald Trump is simply lying. The term to use is Liar.

      But the media is holding back, their critisism is nuanced and careful, most Trump supporters do not even get message (beyond “they are bashing Trump”, even when they write a balanced piece about his own words).

      Basically what we are seeing at the moment is the fairy tale ” The Emperor’s New Clothes”. Trump is naked, but nobody is calling it out (Liar, fraud) the way it should be called.

      This will end sometime.

      1. AndyG55

        The ONLY liar here is YOU, sop.

        And your LIES and outright FAIRY TALES are getting more and more DESPERATE by the day.

        It really is so funny to watch. 🙂

      2. AndyG55

        Meanwhile, Trump has had an immediate cooling effect on the planet, with CruTemp (land) showing its fastest 8 month drop in over 100 years

        https://s19.postimg.org/6ss3k6b8z/crutem_drop.png

        Facts hurt you, don’t they sop.

        And if you really think the far-left press is going to have any effect on Trump, you are desperately FOOLING yourself.

        1. yonason

          Poor sop and company. They don’t have the faintest clue that the elites care NOTHING about them. The useful idiots much in lock step to help the elites, but the elites don’t even know they exist. And the fools haven’t a clue.
          http://www.weaselzippers.us/311917-hillary-clinton-throwing-party-to-thank-millionaire-donors/

  5. yonason

    “Trump knows nothing about the climate.” – sod

    He understands business, and how the climate scam is an assault on freedom and the economy which already has and would continue to destroy the productivity upon which the health of America and the world depends. That’s all anyone need understand about the climate scam.

    1. sod

      “He understands business, and how the climate scam is an assault on freedom and the economy which already has and would continue to destroy the productivity upon which the health of America and the world depends.”

      that is garbage. In the real world, all sort of pollution is causing real health problems and climate change is just a very big part of it.

      Trump will run into courts fighting his denial:

      https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/energy-environment/wp/2016/12/01/trump-could-face-the-biggest-trial-of-the-century-over-climate-change/?utm_term=.c77a179523de

      And plenty of cities will be forced to fight pollution in their streets, meaning stricter rules on cars and coal.

      1. David Johnson

        More dross, our cities are more pollution free than at any time in the last 100 years

        1. David Appell

          David: Can you prove that? I suspect not….

          1. AndyG55

            Apart from that tragic lake incident were a NATURAL CO2 cloud was released, can you point to anywhere that has any CO2 pollution.

          2. yonason

            I don’t know about 100 years, as we didn’t have the technology to measure it, but we have for the last 50, and it’s been CONSTANT improvement.
            https://eos.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/01/PARRISH_4823_Fig-2_rgb.jpg

          3. AndyG55

            Yes yonason,

            it is called PROGRESS and DEVELOPMENT.

            You know, those things the green anti-CO2 agenda strives to halt in developed countries, and deny to developing countries.

          4. yonason

            Right AndyG55! And it couldn’t have been done without the abundant affordable energy they now want to take away from us, to send us back to the dark ages.

          5. yonason

            @ Rotten Appell

            I have, in one of my posts to NTZ. Go find it, you lazy troll.

          6. yonason

            “David: Can you prove that? I suspect not….” – rotten appell

            As I just wrote, I posted on that before, and won’t bother to repost what you should have seen there.

            But it is up to you to show that pollution is a problem, since you are asserting it. Yet you NEVER DO. You just make wild accusations. Time to put up or shut up, not that you will, because your kind never do. I suspect drug induced brain damage, based on observations of others like you, though I could be wrong about that. You might just be a natural born jerk.

      2. AndyG55

        “In the real world, all sort of pollution is causing real health problems and climate change is just a very big part of it.”

        Yes sop, there are REAL pollution issues in third world and developing countries.

        And yes sop, the climate change agenda has stopped and is stopping those developing countries from starting to fix their problems.

        Decent, solid, RELIABLE, fossil fuel power would start to help solve a very large proportion of those REAL pollution issues.

        The anti-CO2 scam and the renewable non-energy scam have a LOT to answer for in halting the progress of energy systems in developing countries and syphoning funds into their own pockets instead of where they are most needed..

      3. AndyG55

        Looks like the child journalists at WaPo are getting just as DESPERATE as sop is.

        Trump gets to name the next supreme court judge.

        And these little BRAIN-WASHED, USED and ABUSED children will have to come up with real science to back there claims.

        And as sop knows.. there isn’t any.

        The right to a healthy environment is a world wide issue, and the anti-CO2 agenda is stopping that right in many developing countries.

        I doubt if one of this naïve little children have ever been in a really unhealthy environment.

        The naïve little sop obviously has, his upbringing must have been truly horrendous.

      4. yonason

        Windmills won’t solve this problem.
        http://medicalxpress.com/news/2012-06-open-fire-cooking-affect-child-cognitive.html

        Only cheap energy can help people dig themselves out of poverty. But the policies you advocate, sod, deny them the means to live a decent life. They will continue to get sick and die young, because of the greedy con artists you keep defending.

        You are NOT a good person!

      5. AndyG55

        Here’s a task for you, sop..

        (which you will undoubtedly ignore as usual)

        Name one US city that is affected by REAL pollution from a coal fired power station.

        The ONLY affect these naïve tools (as in being USED by the anti-CO2 scammers) might have is to speed up NOx and SO2 filter installation.

        But it can be shown that that is progressing swiftly as well.

        http://www.eia.gov/todayinenergy/images/2013.02.27/emissions.png

        So in America and most developed countries… these little kiddies and their handlers haven’t got a fact to stand on.

        1. sod

          “Name one US city that is affected by REAL pollution from a coal fired power station.”

          Kansas City fails on the national sulphur level.

          http://news.stlpublicradio.org/post/sierra-club-missouri-air-quality-regulators-need-better-represent-metro-areas

          Here are 35 US mayors signing a letter to trump mostly about climate change, but also about city pollution. They are feeling the pressure from the people in their cities. These are facts!

          1. AndyG55

            So, no CO2 problem

            Thanks for the confirmation. 🙂

            And Sierra club and 35 far leftist mayors.

            .. roflmao..

            Irrelevant propaganda pap seems to be all you have.

          2. yonason

            “Here are 35 US mayors signing a letter to trump mostly about climate change, but also about city pollution.” – sod

            LOLOL – Sierra Club. Are you ever gullible!

            Mayors sign letter complaining about “climate change” proves . . . . NOTHING!

            …complaining about “city pollution” proves . . . . they want someone else to do their job.

            It is THEIR responsibility to keep their city clean. That’s why they were elected. If they can’t do the job, they need to be replaced with mayors who can.

            And if people think it’s too hot in the city, they’re probably right.
            http://katerina-mazur.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/01/28.png

            But there is nothing short of moving to the country that will solve that problem.

          3. sod

            “LOLOL – Sierra Club. Are you ever gullible!”

            Kansas City missed the limit. Please stop ignoring the facts.

            “And if people think it’s too hot in the city, they’re probably right.

            But there is nothing short of moving to the country that will solve that problem.”

            yes they can do stuff. Make the city green by adding plants to walls and roofs. break cold air gaps into the city, that allow air to flow. change building materials.

            your graph is utterly useless by the way. so there is no other city in the 100 km radius around Paris?

          4. AndyG55

            As I said.. massive gains on putting correct scrubbers on power stations. Still some to do.

            http://www.eia.gov/todayinenergy/images/2013.02.27/emissions.png

            Why hasn’t Kansas done so?

            The point is that these naïve children are being USED and MALIPULATED into making the case about CO2, which is NOT pollution and is NOT a problem.

            I still can’t see anything that says the Kansas has a CO2 problem.

            If so much money wasn’t being WASTED on the CO2 non-problem, REAL pollution could actually be dealt with properly.

          5. yonason

            “sulphur level”

            hahahahahaha

            SO2 is not the big boggieman it’s been accused of being.
            https://www.cfact.org/2014/02/16/global-warming-hysteria-the-acid-rain-scare-and-other-money-making-megamyths/

            Did you know that there’s a volcano in Africa that emits more SO2 than all the cars and factories in America?

            “Nyiragongo is producing more than any place in the world, up to 50,000 tons per day. That’s more than the amount produced by all power plants, factories and cars in the United States.”
            http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/transcripts/3215_volcanoc.html

            And there’s another in the Pacific that emits even more? And that’s only 2 volcanoes out of 1500 active.
            https://www2.usgs.gov/faq/categories/9819/2689

            Oh, and look at the DEVISTATION due to SO2 of the tropical forest near another active volcano.
            http://www.nathab.com/uploaded-files/carousels/TRIPS/Costa-Rica-Jewels/Central-America-Costa-Rica-Jewels-9-volcano.jpg

            You watermelons beclown yourselves.

          6. AndyG55

            Meanwhile, The 1927 (yes it really is that old) Veolia coal power plant in Kansas which provides underground heating and cooling for much of the CBD, is finally changing to gas.

            Going gas, is apparently “going green”.

            Not a wind turdine or solar panel in sight. 🙂

            http://www.kansascity.com/news/business/technology/article91144052.html

            There is no way in h*** that solar and wind could EVER replace what this ANCIENT power/heating/cooling plant can do.

          7. yonason

            “There is no way in h*** that solar and wind could EVER replace what this ANCIENT power/heating/cooling plant can do.” – AndyG55

            Catch22?
            Their biggest problem is smog (due to NOx).
            It accumulates when there is little or no wind.
            Wind turbines would therefore be useless when they would be needed most.

        2. AndyG55

          “your graph is utterly useless by the way.”

          And sop DENIES the Urban Heat Effect.

          Seems the poor brain-washed sap is ignorant, as well as being scientifically and mathematically illiterate.

          Sop is a DENIER.

          1. yonason

            “Seems the poor brain-washed sap is ignorant, as well as being scientifically and mathematically illiterate.” – AndyG55

            “Seems the poor brain-dead sap is ignorant, as well as….”

            There. Fixed it for you. 😉

          2. yonason

            Oh, and addressing sob’s claim that Kansas city didn’t meet the Sulfur limit. Well, if one sets the bar lower than can be met, and lower even than necessary, OF COURSE THEY DIDN’T MEET IT.

            I can’t wait for Trump’s people to reign in the rabbid out of control EPA, not to mention holding them accountable for the damage they have done.

      6. DirkH

        “that is garbage. In the real world, all sort of pollution is causing real health problems and climate change is just a very big part of it. ”

        A CHANGE in CLIMATE – which is the THIRTY YEAR AVERAGE OF WEATHER so it takes a LOOOONG time to change – causes anyone health problems?

        You do realize that in one month you can WALK across Europe, for instance? To where it’s COLDER or WARMER or WHATEVER you like?

        The complete unwillingness to think and the complete incapability to recognize the hilarity of their own words show that warmunists are REALLY deep in cognitive dissonance, into hallucinations.

        1. David Appell

          “You do realize that in one month you can WALK across Europe, for instance? To where it’s COLDER or WARMER or WHATEVER you like?”

          Some can. Not everyone.

          Why are there red deer in England, but not south of Morocco and Tunisia?

          1. AndyG55

            “Morocco’s native mammal species include foxes, jackals, genets, hyenas, panthers, gazelles and the famous Barbary ape. However, with livestock numbering around 28 million (excluding mules, horses and camels), the most common animals to be seen are sheep, goats and cattle”

            “The wildlife of Tunisia is composed of its flora and fauna. It has 84 species of mammals and 375 species of birds. Tunisia is well documented for its addax and Dama Gazelle population.”

            Why are there no addax, gazelles, panthers etc in the UK.

            So funny watching you try to raise yourself to the most basic level of climate propaganda, you goreless twerp.

          2. yonason

            @AndyG55

            Well, there are Moroccan, Algerian and Tunisian REFUGEES in the UK.
            http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3397021/Just-0-5-Syrian-migrants-arrested-crime-Cologne-year.html

            Personally, if I were a Brit, I would much prefer the gazelles.

          3. yonason

            …ooops, those weren’t in the UK yet, fortunately for the UK.

    2. David Appell

      How is climate change an assault on freedom?

      The US has had a cap-and-trade program since the Bush I administration. How has it limited freedom here?

      1. yonason

        Your argument from ignorant people doing stupid things doesn’t hold water. Yes it did begin to infringe on our liberties, as well as our prosperity. It was an unnecessary waste, based on faux “science.”

        Bush screwed up, so you think we should, too? What a genius you are!

  6. Will Janoschka

    test

  7. yonason

    Reason can only return to those who know what being reasonable is, or can learn. I’m thinking that these guys may be too challenged in that department.

    “The World Bank must end its support for the industries that cause climate change, Germany’s federal development minister Gerd Müller has said.”
    http://www.climatechangenews.com/2016/12/01/germany-tells-world-bank-to-quit-funding-fossil-fuels/

    Wars have been started with far less provocation.

    1. Mick J

      Reminds me of this essay, how those in the developing world suffer at the hands of the developed countries who work to create what the author calls “energy poverty”. Maybe there would be somewhat less desperate people migrating to seek a better life if it had not be denied them in their home countries.

      https://iceagenow.info/world-needs-energy/

      1. yonason

        Yes. The section here with the interview of Tom Harris touches on that.
        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uBPXjQRJA90&feature=youtu.be&t=578

      2. David Appell

        How, specifically, is energy being denied?

        1. AndyG55

          World Bank will not fund new RELIABLE power, only useless intermittent unreliables

          Coal, oil, gas have built the developed countries.

          They are denying the poor countries a chance to develop and overcome poverty.

          But you DON’T CARE, do you rotten-Appell.

        2. yonason

          you really are a bottom feeder, at best.

          “Access to cheap and abundant power is one of the best ways to lift people out of poverty. Analyses show that there is a clear connection between growth and energy availability in Africa. Most spectacularly, China lifted 680 million people out of poverty over the past 30 years — not through expensive wind and solar, but through cheap, if polluting, coal.”
          http://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/2014/02/08/bjorn-lomborg-africa-energy/5284631/

          1. AndyG55

            “but through cheap, if polluting, coal.”

            China’s modern coal fired power stations are probably among the cleanest in the world when it comes to real pollution.

    2. AndyG55

      World Bank is part of the UN isn’t it.

      Why is the UN so stuck on stopping underdeveloped countries from developing?

      1. yonason

        “Why is the UN so stuck on stopping underdeveloped countries from developing?” – AndyG55

        Good question, as is it’s corollary – ‘Why are the UN and those who subscribe to their climate religion so hell bent on un-developing the developed nations’?

        “Some of the biggest employers and most intensive energy users in the country are so concerned about unreliable power supply in the southern states they are ­reconsidering investment, in a move that would have a devastating impact on tens of thousands of jobs.”
        http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news/nation/jobs-at-risk-blackouts-spook-big-companies/news-story/3d13f83bcc32b07f5a996dbf7e0b5ccb

  8. David Appell

    “Physicist Dr. Peter Heller wrote at the German language Science Skeptical here how the election of Donald Trump could mean “the return to reason in climate policy”

    This is, of course, absurd. Trump doesn’t know anything about climate change, just like he is ignorant of nearly every subject he faces.

    Trump told the NY Times that:

    “Bennett: When you say an open mind, you mean you’re just not sure whether human activity causes climate change? Do you think human activity is or isn’t connected?

    “Trump: I think right now … well, I think there is some connectivity. There is some, something.”

    http://www.nytimes.com/2016/11/23/us/politics/trump-new-york-times-interview-transcript.html

    1. AndyG55

      YAWN, you really are getting Desperate. !!

    2. yonason

      “I think there is some connectivity. There is some, something.” – Trump according Appell

      And that is what any well balanced skeptic, and climate scientist says. There is “SOME” connection with human activity. That’s all the evidence points to, …maybe. There is no “smoking gun.”

      Just because he is sane and sensible, and isn’t an activist freak like Al Gore, is no reason to hate him.

    3. AndyG55

      “There is “SOME” connection with human activity”

      Yes, the urban heat temperatures and airport temps feed through to Gavin’s fabrications. Trump knows about urban heat.. and he KNOWS about Gavin’s mal-adjustments.

      Satellite temperatures show ZERO WARMING apart from El Nino events and ocean oscillation effects.

      There is absolutely NO CO2 temperature signal in the untampered, unaffected temperature records.

      1. sod

        “Satellite temperatures show ZERO WARMING apart from El Nino events and ocean oscillation effects.”

        this claim is a lie. You are illiterate on numbers. please go looking for a primary school.

        1. AndyG55

          You are WRONG as usual. I am CORRECT.

          There is NO WARMING from 1980-1997

          https://s19.postimg.org/y6om3sbjn/RSS_Before_El_Nino.jpg

          There is NO WARMING from 2001 (final culmination of 1998 El Nino effect) and mid 2015 (start of recent El Nino

          https://s19.postimg.org/im6e8dgxf/RSS_pre_2015.png

          The ONLY warming comes from the El Nino step change between 1997 and 2001, and the now subsided 2015/2016 El Nino

          Places that are not affected by El Ninos or ocean cycles such as the AMO HAVE NOT WARMED..

          End of story !!!!

          I’m sorry you are so ignorant that cannot accept the data right in front of you.

          And the only reason I would need to visit a primary school would be to teach you from the very start, because your ignorance can only stem from a deep-seat lack of any sort of basic education.

          1. Seven

            Thank you for pointing out this information. While many might find the truth distasteful, it is refreshing to see the blogosphere, while it is still allowed to function, printing undeniable facts which the MSM and &qott;conservaoive&quut; media will not touch. Kudos to you.

          2. sod

            “There is NO WARMING from 2001 (final culmination of 1998 El Nino effect) and mid 2015 (start of recent El Nino”

            that is a lie. you are looking only at satellite data.

            Hint: when you remove the warming by calling it a “step”, you will end up with little warming.That is called cheating in the real world!

  9. gallopingcamel

    You can thank people like Maurice Strong for that:
    QUOTE
    Isn’t the only hope for the planet that the industrialized civilizations collapse? Isn’t it our responsibility to bring that about?
    UNQUOTE

  10. yonason

    And don’t forget.

    Trump is a racist.

    Yeah, Riiiiiight!!!

  11. yonason
  12. David Appell

    “Heller then adds that if the climate alarmists had their way, they “would not only destroy our current prosperity, but also rob mankind of all options to further prosper in the future.”

    Heller: What is the cost of having to adapt to climate change?

    1. AndyG55

      Warming.. Not much… probably beneficial.

      Cooling .. a horrendous amount

      Either way we need cheap RELIABLE energy to be able to overcome what occurs NATURALLY.

      Those RELIABLE energy supplies would be fossil fuel or hydro, renewables don’t even come close to being reliable.

      And the HUGE BENEFIT of fossil fuel power is the secondary production of much needed atmospheric CO2.. you know the gas, which with H2O, provides food for ALL LIFE ON EARTH….

      …. even cockroaches like you Appell.